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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 6:12 pm 
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Leia-gate: the untold story.

Thought I might as well clarify my side of last week's twitter spat (twat?) over alleged socio-politically dubious tweets about cosplay. The incident seems to have been blown out of all proportion to the extent that in some parts of the world, locals believe I engaged in hand to labia combat with a giant man eating vagina and was eventually forced into hiding by an army of furious clitoratti. This is only a half truth.

A whole truth is that people got unduly attacked, bullied even, long after I had retreated to meditate on the whole affair and lick my figurative wounds.

Looking back it seems to me the whole thing was a mess of misunderstanding, misrepresentation and intolerance on all sides and demonstrated what a frustrating, clamourous place twitter can be.

The original tweeter (OT), whose identity I will protect here for fear of even further reprisal, accused me of sexism, claiming I was advocating the objectification of women by expressing a penchant for cosplay girls; although I believe her argument was not simply a case of 'don't perv over Slave Leias you unreconstructed male you.''

My initial tweet on the matter described cosplay girls as a combination of two of my favourite "things". I think perhaps the OT assumed I was referring to women as "things" which would be understandably offensive (the other"thing" in the equation being cosplay itself). The implication in this case would indeed be that these women are objects, there solely for me(n) to lust after. This is not what I meant.

The "things" I referred to were respectively, the unilateral concept of sexiness and the fantasy genre itself, combining to create something doubly fun. It was cheeky yes but playful and I would hope non threatening, since I was only expressing the very human tendency to be sexually inspired by visual stimulus.

I then exacerbated matters (whatever that means) by posting a picture I had taken during the Paul shoot, of a group of women all in Slave Leia garb and accompanied it with a Homer Simpson "mmmmm" noise. Okay, so this was even more cheeky but again meant in good humour and not intended as a democratising wink to my male followers but for everyone. I do not advocate gender prejudice, I try hard in my own writing to be enlightened and sensitive and as far as I know, am not renowned as a bigot. I therefore assumed, wrongly it would seem, both tweets would be received in the spirit they were intended.

Discovering a flurry of protest on my feed, not solely but mainly from the OT, I got very defensive. My responses were flippant and back footed and it's fair to say I could have handled it better. My first response of "BORING" was a misjudged call back to Homer Simpson but when I realised the complaint was serious, I became irked that it had not been permitted to slip by with impunity. I felt pilloried and ambushed and rather than take it on the chin, I fought back in anger.

Don't get me wrong, I believe it naive; wrong headed even, to suggest that anyone should deny their emotional responses to apparel that is specifically designed to inspire an emotional response, but I do believe we should moderate those responses and how we act upon them. It's wrong to act irresponsibly then blame someone else, or worse cry 'human nature'. That way lies the "she was asking for it" defence, a monstrous exercise in blame shifting which has terrorised and isolated victims of sexual abuse forever and certainly not one I was prepared to use to defend a wilfully childish tweet.

It all comes down to respect and understanding. Those Slave Leias are undoubtedly dressed as an objectified woman. Jabba the Hutt forced Leia to dress like that to demoralise and disempower her. It was an act of gross misogyny by His Fatness to chain Leia up in a gold bikini and one that poetically also became his undoing, since he was throttled with a literal manifestation of the chains of male oppression . As well as an ironic plot twist, it was also a very primal male domination fantasy. George wasn't trying to make a comment about patriarchal dominance through aggressive promotion of gender stereotypes, he was trying to give teenage boys a boner. He succeeded. I try to remember his success in this matter whenever I think of the prequels which effectively had the opposite effect for me.

The women who dress as slave Leia are not forced into it, nor as far as I know, do they feel demoralised by it. They own it and just as any woman or man who enjoys provocative cosplay, they are fully aware of the response their efforts will attract, welcome it, so long as those responses are moderated to non threatening appreciation, not assumption or abuse.

Comic Con and events like it serve much as carnival did in the middle ages, as a means of turning the world upside down. For people who live average lives to stride through a crowd demanding objectification, whether the Fett be Boba or booty. We do them a disservice by not acknowledging their efforts appropriately. That doesn't mean gooses and whistles, it means maturity even when you're being childish.

We must be open about our responses, we must have a sense of humour about about them so as not attach the wrong emotions to sex and sexuality. Suppressing a harmless if predictable reaction to someone who is actively projecting sexuality will surely only cause resentment and shame, fear even. And as we all know fear leads to anger, anger leads to aggression, aggression leads to hate and hate, well hate leads to Twitter.

The key is to moderate your responses to be proportionate with that which you're responding to. Slave Leia reminds me of my first crush, of the youthful fizz of sexual awakening and yes, I freely admit it, it gives me the horn. It does not make me a hater or even disrespecter of women.

What I found most disturbing about the incident was the level of scorn heaped upon the OT and on another tweeter I RT'd later, simply to allow people to see the entire exchange, knowing full well I had been a bit of a knob. I did not apologise to the OT because I felt lambasted for something that had been twisted into an offence by arguably narrow thinking but I did want to take responsibility for my own error in responding childishly. This however lead to a whole new wave of derision on someone who had in this instance correctly called me out.

To both of those people, I am whole heartedly sorry if the incident brought any discomfort your way. We may sit on different sides of the debating hall but I wish you nothing but love and happiness. That's all I wish for any good hearted human being.

I'm not leaving Twitter or even hiding, I just feel a little let down by it as a medium of communication. We as tweeters are united through this nexus, our numbers could populate a continent, our potential to effect change beyond territorial borders is awesome and exciting. We operate beyond the control of executive power and instead exist as a potentially pure force of democracy. It could make the world a better place and arguably has but then again, it could just be a lot of opinionated narcissists talking at the same time. At the moment for me, it feels like the latter.

Any road up, this is not a prelude to further debate, just my take on an enlightening incident. Thanks for reading. Vegetable rights and peace.

Simon
23/07/12


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:00 pm 
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Like A Little Flower

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I follow your twitter and I posted this on my Facebook as note after what happened to you and Louis C.K.
Being friends with a lot of pretty and popular cosplayers it is a fine line to walk.

I titled it
Live and Learn
I don't usually post anything political or preachy but a midst the the back lash from a sense of humor or posting or a misguided comment of a group of Slave Leia's from Comic-con.

There is a fundamental difference between between telling a joke and saying you admire someone for looking good in a provocative costume and actually being misogynistic. I believe in having an opinion and a sense of humor. Just because someone does not understand this humor or opinion doesn't mean it is fundamentally wrong. It is just a difference in opinion.

I don't consider myself as feminist but I do believe in true equality. Being raised as an immigrant, by a single mother, a rich Jewish family, an illiterate step mother with a gay step brother. I know what diversity and struggle is in life on almost every level. They all had a sense of humor and that all a sense of equal opinion for all. Most of all a sense of understanding of one another. No matter how different they are and how foreign the concepts of they had of each other.

All this experience I had been given has taught me to believe in my convictions and opinions. Also to give opportunity learn from people I do not fully understand.

It is my belief that not enough people take the time to learn and be taught by the people around them. Most of them are too busy teaching and imposing what they believe in because in their limited experience and wisdom no one else can be right or have a different opinion besides their own.

I live and learn. I strive to understand and be understood. If you don’t understand the humor do not assume malevolence in it. You do not like the comment do not imply malintent in it. Try to understand and accept there are people who are just as “good” as you are but still have different opinions.

It takes all kinds to make the world go round but it also takes understanding to make the world a livable place.

This post was inspired by Simon Pegg, Louis C.K. and being a nerd.

Here are 3 videos that better illustrate my point by someone more intelligent and acticulate than I am Louis C.K.

First a joke!
http://youtu.be/wu9q4sM1vmc

Then the learning!
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-j ... louis-c-k-

Now the understanding. (Retweeted by Louis C.K.)
http://youtu.be/S5pM1fW6hNs


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:05 pm 
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I'm just going to comment with one of my favourite quotes.

"We have to stop this recent culture of people telling us they’re offended and expecting us to give a fuck." - Ricky Gervais

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:09 pm 
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Like A Little Flower

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It must be quite terrifying to watch the hordes leap to your defense and not stop leaping even when there is no need for it any more. Do you think we can campaign for a 'Twitter Launch Code' (I hesitate to say 'Back Door') that can be entered to cancel the Mob Nukes?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:31 pm 
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Like A Little Flower

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Thanks for taking the time to reflect on the incident and to thoughtfully respond. In your defense, I must agree that the OT seemed a bit extreme in her views. I have a very hard time wrapping my head around the concept of not being appreciative of the visual charms of another -- whether that be the cosplayer in the metal bikini, or admiring the person who has decorated their skin with well-done tattoos or is sporting hair that's a lovely shade of lavender. When one finds something aesthetically pleasing, to be told it's not okay to admire is... disjointing.

I think you simply had the misfortune of being in the wrong place at the wrong time -- which would be on Twitter, and on the heels of two feminist scandals perpetraded by comedians. Triggers are unruly little things -- one starts out being justifiably angered by a singular incident (and the people who support the offender), and the next thing you know every man one comes into contact with is a mysoginist. Nobody starts out the day with the goal of being offended by everyone, but when you're already raw from an experience, it really doesn't take much to reopen the wound.

Anyway, thank you, and keep being awesome.

Regards,
Ava


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 8:56 pm 
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Hi there,

I would like to give some insight into the perspective of a female cosplayer who has worn a few skimpy outfits in her time. I'm afraid I'd rather stay anonymous (though if you wish for me to confirm my identity directly to you, I'm happy to do that!).

The only segment of what you wrote bothered me is this, and I'll explain why.

Simon Pegg wrote:
They own it and just as any woman or man who enjoys provocative cosplay, they are fully aware of the response their efforts will attract, welcome it, so long as those responses are moderated to non threatening appreciation, not assumption or abuse.


I bolded the 'welcome it' part for good reason. Do I expect it? Yes. Welcome it? *I* personally, do not. I put up with it, sure but I can't say that it is a thing that I want.

Compliments on my costume? Hell yeah, I'm a costumer, I make all my shit by hand and I'm damn proud of it. So I'm really happy to hear those. Heck, even if someone complimented me on my appearance in a polite way "That costume looks great on you" etc, that is fine. But 'compliments' that are basically "hurrr drool" .. nah, not so much. It's a bit awkward at best, gonna be honest.

I wear my costumes because I LOVE the character. I can be them for one day, I can prance around as a nerd to my nerdy delight - with my friends mostly! Nearly all of my costumes have been made to go with friends costumes to have fun with them. I don't wear my costumes for anyone other than me.

I can only speak for myself here, but I'm not the only one who feels similarly. Yes there are female cosplayers out there who LOVE the attention and pretty much only wear skimpy costumes for that reason. But that aint my bag, baby. Cosplayers are like all other people, they vary greatly.

I'm sorry that you had to deal with someone else criticising you on behalf of the Slave Leia girls, because I'm sure they weren't bothered at all (I imagine they are friends since they worked with you - I often let my friends say things I would be uncomfortable by strangers saying) but, maybe it's proved to be a useful insight. Tbh, I do think it was blown out of proportion, I don't think such a comment should have warranted anything more than an eyeroll but there we go.

As a side note, I'm an English cosplayer. I'm sure we'd all forgive you if you came to the London MCM Expo sometime and let us dress you up in a Slave Leia Bikini. ;)


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2012 9:08 pm 
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It's what I got from the whole shenanigan in the first place, so the reassuring bit is that it must have been obvious for some.

It is true that it is difficult to put the right intonation or inflection to written text, but I would have thought that, with you being a well known - and loved(but not in this way) - public figure, the lightness and tongue-in-cheek nature of the comment would have been easily perceived/picked on.

I didn't envy your place at the time (but now I'm better and have resumed envying you*) nor did I envy the OT position. A sorry business it was...
I sincerely hope you're okay now, both of you (and any other party involved), it is never nice to be caught in a shit-storm. :?


Oh! And good luck with the soon to be seriously misconstrued "live average lives" bit. :wink:




* See, this with the wrong ton of voice in mind could be seriously freaky... which I realised after... That's why I'm adding this and pretend I'm not unhinged. :mrgreen:

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:06 am 
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aka MyDogAteLA
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I'm sorry to hijack Simon's blog post for this, but I wanted to welcome all new members and apologize for any delay in approving new accounts. We get a lot of spam sign ups, so I have to approve all the real accounts individually.

If, for any reason, your account hasn't been approved, please send me an email at harmony(at)peggster(dot)net.

Harmony
Webmaster

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 1:32 am 
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Before I begin

This is about a personal experience trying to explain a point. Trying to compare sexism to disability discrimination and why life with disabilities doesn't have to be bad and what sexism can learn from that. FEEL FREE TO SKIP MY RAMBALINGS. Please don't be nasty to me. I'm only sharing my thoughts and feelings.

Sometimes you need a sense of humour and to see the funny side of life!

I'm a woman and I'm a mechanical engineer so I work in a 'mans world'.

I also suffer with multiple chronic illnesses including a genetic connection tissue disorder. This affects my joins (I get joint pain and frequent joint dislocation) and internal organs (for me its my heart, brain, lungs and veins).

I spend lots of time at routine hospital appointments or random emergency treatment that leaves me staying a in few days unplanned. I take lots of medication, need lots of rest, have special diets, feel very ill and have lots of pain. Sometimes I can't stand up because my heart goes mad and sometimes I can't remember anything. It can be very annoying but also very very funny!

I work, study and live with men. The guys where I work are brilliant. They are always making fun of my crazy joints and my periods of semi / fully unconsciousness. They have given me nicknames relating to my disabilities and make fun of me when I use my crutches or my walking stick.

This is brilliant! When I feel down they cheer me up and make me laugh. Why? Because I have a sense of humour. Why? Because I need one.

I don't get insulted when they laugh. I laugh with them as I have learned to see the funny side. If you let things go you enjoy life so much more. if you let things get to you then it will upset you and that makes life harder.

I know I could stand up for myself and say its 'against disability rights! I should be treated equally and fairly!' And your right I should. But I am being treated equally and fairly. I'm going to work and having a laugh with the boys over coffee. We're also laughing at david and what he did last weekend and emma and what happened when she got drunk with her friends.

That's equal and fair to me. I'm not having fun despite my disabilities, I'm having fun because of my disabilities. Its all about prospective. We all have dreams we want to achieve. Some will never achieve them because they don't want to achieve them and other will never achieve them because they can't.

British humour is often misinterpreted at the best of times and it is so hard to convey tone when writing which just exacerbates things (whatever that means). What we really need is a 'what we say' - 'what we mean' translator. That should help with the misunderstanding.

Sorry about the ramble.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 2:20 am 
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Great comments everyone and HELLO to all the new members :D

Those that follow me on Twitter and Facebook...my condolences to you :wink: already know my comments on this whole situation so I will not bore again with my rant. But, I will say I am glad that Simon posted on here even if it was for something like this I know we all welcome his presence on the board :D As a cosplayer myself please keep giving cosplayers positive comments on their costumes. You don't always have confidence to wear a costume, but you can gain the confidence from support from fellow costumers and fans of it. Sometimes a positive comment can go a long way for someone :D

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:10 pm 
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This makes me sad to know that there is so much hate on Twitter. People misinteperate what people have said and would like to have it clarified. It doesn't have to turn into a huge debate! Seriously guys, can't we get on with each other? Simon was just making a comment. I completely understood what he was trying to say and someone didn't. They tried to get their opinion across to Simon. The fact that people started having a go at the OT is absolutely disgraceful! Everyone has an opinion that they're entitled to.

Let's just let it pass, eh? YOLO (You only live once), so why not live in peace, yeah? :)

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 1:17 am 
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I feel like fundamentally here the best solution here would be to cosplay as slave leia. It would show your appreciation for cosplay and the costume, and quite honestly I think you could rock the bikini.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 11:31 am 
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As a long-time fan of Simon's, I took his tweets in the spirit they were meant. I know he embraces equality, but is also a bloke who likes women (like any hetero bloke).
I'm also a feminist (though not a rampaging one) & sexism makes me angry. But this is tempered with a very healthy sense of humour. So while I was not offended by Simon's tweets, I did see the "OT"'s point of view.
In my opinion, the only truly wrong people in this whole scenario were the haters attacking both parties. Shameful.

Feel the love. Truly.
dolfyn.
:heart:

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Well I won't argue that it was a no-holds-barred adrenaline-fuelled thrill-ride, but there's no way you could perpetrate that amount of carnage & mayhem & not incur a considerable amount of paperwork.


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 25, 2012 5:49 pm 
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Lordy . . miss being on Twitter and the forum for a few days and all hell breaks loose!

It's a damn shame that the whole blow up happened.

As a gal, a cosplayer and a nerd - was I offended at all by Simon's tweets? Nope. I guess because I had a good idea of how his tweets were intended to be - and to me that was not sexist at all, but in the same silly comedic way that my own husband, male friends and my own brother had made similar type jokes/comments in the past Now I know those guys personally not to be sexist pigs - and they know that if they had an inkling of seriousness about such remarks, they'd all get ripped a new one, by yours truly along with their girlfriends/significant others. Now, Simon and I may not be BFFs, but from the little interaction I've had with him and all of the interaction I've heard of him having with others here, I know he's one of the good guys.

I do believe this crazy electronic medium we all fool around on just makes it difficult these days for people to truly communicate their intentions. There is no easy way to get a speaker's physical or true verbal/vocal cues from a statement that is limited to only 140 characters. It's too easy to take offense at things that may be said with a more light hearted intention and at the same rate, it's hard to see if someone is really just being a jackass. The thing is, you have to know the source of the statement.

as an aside . .I love cosplaying . . had I the body to rock a Slave Leia outfit my husband would kneel at my feet and weep with joy if I wore it. But even so, I don't think I'd do it - it's too drafty of a costume for me, and no pockets to keep my wallet and smart phone! :lol: But I give props to the gals who do it. Here was my favorite Slave Leia from last year's NYCC.

Image

He and the very large hairy guy wearing a Wonder Woman costume were two of the best cosplayers I saw that wknd.

Whatever sex you are and whatever gender you decide to dress up as, you have to own it and wear it with pride. :mrgreen:

Though I do understand the practicality of the sexy skimpy outfits. It get too hot in those convention centers. Wearing little to nothing at least keeps you comfortable!

I was sweating to death, myself in my Snape outfit :rofl:

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Tim: Well, you know, you’re getting old. You’d be dead in four years . . .if this was Logan’s Run.
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Tim: I know, I’d look like a twat in a jumpsuit.
Daisy: Don’t say that, Tim. That’s a word that hates women.
Tim: What, twat?
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 26, 2012 3:12 am 
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There's a lot to be said about women and the male gaze, what it means/doesn't mean to be "welcoming" it, and how it all creates an atmosphere of hostility-- but I'm not sure that any of that chatter gets to the root of the problem at all. The deeper issue is the hyper-sexualized image of women in media such as films, video games, comics, etc., which is really the commodification of women's bodies. The images of half-naked female characters, for example, do a number of things, including: influencing young women to over-value aesthetics and emphasize and commodify her own body, it tells men that it's okay to view women as sex objects which leads to really serious things such as violence against women, and the images create and perpetuate damaging beauty ideals which can lead to eating disorders, low self-esteem, etc. All of this is harmful to women as a whole, and is truly an assault on half the population for the sake of profit (and probably dominance-- a point which can be argued, I'm sure).

Now, all that said, I'm also a huge Simon Pegg fan. I've seen everything from Asylum to Mission Impossible Ghost Protocol, charmed by his comedic timing and all that. :rofl: So I was really disappointed to see him buying in to the above stated nonsense. But I'm also disappointed that most men and women buy in to the above stated nonsense. I hope to live to see a world where men and women define beauty for themselves and never view another person as an object as opposed to a whole, complete individual. But that's not the world we live in now.

I myself have fallen victim in engaging in behavior that objectifies another, so how can I be upset at Simon Pegg? This analytical response has turned in to a bit of a confession, I'm afraid. This is because many times Simon Pegg himself has become the object of a certain Time4Cornetto's gaze. It's the comedic timing, I'm telling you! Also, gosh, it's his bum. Mmm. :wink:

+Bonus! 1,000 objectification pts!
+Bonus! "Weird perv" level unlocked!


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